Opus 5 released! Is it better than Fable?

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Do you have a hot takeache, a problem

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worth watching? Share them right here on

Agents Hour.

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>> Agents Hour, every Monday, noon Pacific.

follow. Don't miss it. Peace.

>> This is Agents Hour with Shane Thomas

and Abby Ayer.

Hello everyone and welcome to Agents

Hour. It is Wednesday, July 29th. Today

I'm here as always joined by my

co-founder, friend, co-host, Obby.

What's up, dude?

>> What's up, dude? How are you?

>> Good, good, good to be back home. Last

week, if you saw us live or watch the

recording, we were in London and so that

was fun. So, we're going to talk about

that a bit. We're going to talk about

all the news. There's a lot of drama as

always,

a lot of, you know, a new model release

to talk about. That's always fun. And

we're going to be, you know, we'll see a

short demo and talk about some of the

stuff we're launching over here at MRA.

Before we get started, this is a live

show. So, if you're watching live,

normally do this on Mondays. We're doing

it on Wednesday because of travel. We do

it every week. But you should chat with

us. So, drop a message.

>> Say what's up.

>> Yeah. Say what's up, say hello, ask

questions.

interact, give us your hot takes, we

will pull them up on the show. And if

you're watching after the fact, thank

you. You know, give us that five star

review whether you're on Spotify, Apple

Podcast, YouTube, wherever you are

watching us or listening to us from.

How you doing, dude? How is you're still

in France, right?

>> Went back to Paris after the conference

and uh going home soon. I am ready to go

home.

Yes, it'll be nice to have you back uh

you know back in the United States,

similar time zones at least to me.

>> Yeah, dude. I can't wait to speak

English, dude.

>> It's going to be great.

>> Uh but maybe that's a good segue into

let's talk a bit about TSAI London. That

was a conference we held last week. We

had, you know, 2,000 plus people

virtually signed up. We had, you know,

hundreds of people in person at convene

in London. It was a good time, I guess.

What was your takeaway from the from the

whole like conference week?

>> Um, a couple. So, we got the whole team

together, which was super fun. We were

working towards the things that we were

releasing.

It was stressful at times, but I think,

you know, uh, when you have everyone

together working in person, which is

honestly the most fun part is just

working in person, shooting the [ __ ]

getting [ __ ] done. Um, but I was so

impressed with the conference. One, the

venue was beautiful. And if you've been

to our San Francisco conference, it's

the same venue thing. So, but this one

was just, I mean, a lot nicer. feels

like the quality of the talks were so

good and there was a couple themes that

were just essentially blatantly present

through everybody's talks which was like

software factories.

>> Yeah, I think that was a big one. I

think what I was most impressed with was

the talks as well. of course like

meeting people the net the the the

hallway track is always very fun because

you get to talk to people that are using

>> MRA that are building agents that are

running into a lot of the same problems.

So I think there's one something

therapeutic about it just talking and

relating to other people's problems but

also just getting to know people that

are all it felt kind of like a community

event in in a lot of ways

>> of not just MRA but just people who are

interested in building agents working

with AI working with Typescript you know

a lot of them use MRA of course but not

all of them and it was just great it was

a great like community feel to it felt

more like a community than it did I

think in San Francisco

isn't to say the San Francisco ones

aren't fun, but that one, you know, it

was almost like a different persona

where San Francisco felt like a lot of

like startups, tech, and there were

certainly a lot of that, you know, quite

a bit of that, but it also just felt a

bit more of like a community vibe. But

the talks impressed me a lot because it

was, you know, we had talks at all

different levels, but there was a lot of

like people on the ground shipping

stuff, sharing real

>> things that they've learned. But I think

those are the types of things where you

can actually pull out a couple

actionable things that you're either

going to try that you, you know, might

have ran into just really like useful

type of talks like they're much more

practical rather than just the high

level. And we we did have a little bit

of that which is good. It's a good mix

of like

>> varying levels of uh like in the weeds

versus like what's coming. And I think

that's those are always great to have

like the variance especially in a single

track conference.

Yeah. And we met some of you, the

listeners of the show, came up to us

during the lunch break. Um, very

grateful for all the nice words you all

said. Um, remember we met, you know,

longtime listener in person, John T.

Brook. Uh, so maybe he's watching now or

he will be watching. Shout out to you

and many others. I I mean I think there

was at least a half a dozen people and

it's always weird because they come up

and you know you they're like I feel

like I know you and of course we've

never met at least not in person but

it's great to meet people that actually

watch the show on a weekly basis that

you know we've seen in the chat maybe

but we've never met in person

>> and you don't know that they're going to

be you know where they're all from all

over right so there's obviously like

people in the you know in Europe or in

London and there were people that

traveled in quite a I guess as well, but

most of the people were from the London

area. But yeah, it's great to meet

people in person. You know, we we

wouldn't do this if we didn't, you know,

think it was valuable and we didn't have

people that actually enjoyed watching

it. So, appreciate all of you that did

come up and say hello.

I think we do have uh so Yan, producer

Yan put together a video for as kind of

like a conference recap. So, I figured

we should watch that. So for people who

>> have listened to this and have massive

FOMO,

>> uh you can watch the conference recap

which will give you additional FOMO, but

then you could still watch the talks

afterwards. And so we'll tell you how to

do that here after we watch the video.

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>> [applause]

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>> Heat. Heat.

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>> [music]

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>> Nice. Nice work, Yan.

>> That was it.

>> Yeah. So, if you you know, if you feel

like you missed out, you you did, but

you can go watch the if you watch the

whole live stream. It's on our YouTube.

But if you don't want to watch the

entire thing, we are going to be kind of

taking all the talks, cutting them up,

doing a little bit of editing to make

them, you know, a little even tighter.

And we'll be posting those on YouTube

over the next few weeks as well. So if

you missed it, you can still, you know,

learn from some of the talks, learn

from, you know, some of the things that

we saw in person. So don't feel too bad.

Uh you can still participate in some

ways. And yeah, Sebastian, thanks for

watching. Thanks for checking out the

the live stream.

One of the things we did,

and we do this every time we have a

conference, this is our third, this is

actually our third TSA comp, which is

kind of wild to think about.

Yeah. So, the third conference we've

done,

>> second this year.

>> Yeah. And

>> yeah, we don't have a ne we don't have

another date planned, but there will be

another date at some point. So, know

that if you missed out, there's another

chance. But something we do at every

conference is we talk about the cool

stuff that we're working on. So for

those that are new to the show, you

know, we're two of the founders of

Mastra and we like to ship things over

here that developers like to use and so

we like to talk about what those things

are. A lot of those tie into trends

we're seeing in the industry. A lot of

those tie into very closely what our

users and customers are kind of asking

us for. So, wanted to highlight some of

the things we launched last week and uh

we kind of relaunched them this week

because we talked about them at the

conference, but then we uh we actually

promoted them more broadly. So, if you

watched the conference live, you kind of

get the sneak peek and now we're

actually announcing them to the world

throughout this week. So, why don't we

do that and then I hear Abby, you might

have a demo for us.

>> Yeah. And uh show you what I'm cooking.

>> All right. So,

first things first,

we're going to work backwards, I guess,

because why not? So, first thing first,

this was launched today. We added

environments and regions to master

platform. So, we had a lot of customers

ask us and it might not be a surprise,

you know, we were in London for a

reason. A ton of our customers,

Sebastian, you know what we showed as

well, a ton of our customers are in EU,

right? Are in European region, whether

it's, you know, UK, EU,

and they want their data close to them.

And so we've been working for quite a

while just to add regions so you can

kind of decide where when you deploy to

Masha Platform where you're deploying to

and also environments so you can have

production, staging, preview

environments. And I think that it opens

up a ton of flexibility for actually

deploying your MRA agents and your MRA

applications to our platform.

Any comments on this, Obby?

>> Oh man, I'm just super stoked. Um

because we were running some US

deployments before this launched, let's

say, and I it was just so terrible the

latency. But if you have all your stuff

in your region, it's amazing. Um, and

then coming up next,

maybe I'll tease it a little bit, but we

will do multiszone in the future. If you

are a global company, you'll need that.

>> Yeah. And I think it was easy for us to

like feel the problem firsthand because

we were in EU and I I had a bunch of US

deployments and, you know, latency is

not terrible, but you can feel it,

>> right? Yeah.

>> And you don't want to feel it.

>> So, you definitely don't want to feel

it.

>> All right. Now, let's talk about what we

announced yesterday.

And it's sometimes hard for me to

determine what tab to share. So,

hopefully this is the right one. All

right. Got it. All right. So, we

launched Trace Intelligence.

And

maybe we'll just kind of play play the

video while we're talking through it.

Essentially what it is is it allows you

to take a large amount of traces. It

analyzes those traces into clusters and

themes

and then from there it also kind of

connects patterns across those kind of

clusters that it comes up with. So you

can figure out what's the goal, what's

the behavior, what's the outcome, what's

the sentiment of

clusters of traces and so you can rather

than looking at thousands of individual

traces trying to dig through the data or

asking your agent you know to look

through thousands of traces and process

all that we determine the clusters for

you and then you can manually do it with

this UI which is cool like or you can

just like tell your agent to do it but

they're not looking at tens of thousands

of traces or thousands of traces they're

looking at you know a dozen or two dozen

clusters and then your agent can decide

which clusters to go in. So you don't

have to pay for

>> you know I saw a lot of people saying

like well I use Fable to analyze traces.

It's like not not at scale you don't not

if you're pay

>> with your max plan. Sure.

>> Yeah. With if you if you don't exceed

your max plan yeah just send Fable on

like a group of traces you're good.

>> But if you're if you actually have real

data you're not paying fable prices or

you don't want that level of inference.

So there's a whole bunch of cool stuff

we do under the kind of under the hood

with like deterministic matching, some

ML pipelines, some like inference to

come up with these clusters and then

that way you don't have to pay for top

level intelligence to analyze tens of

thousands of traces.

>> Yeah, some clever things that Eric and

team pul pulled out there. Um and dude,

it went pretty viral from our standards,

I guess.

>> Yeah, if you look at it, it's definitely

kind of taken off. So, it is in beta

right now. So, if you want access, if

you're using Master Platform, let us

know. We'll get you access to it.

[sighs]

All right. And then the one that is

probably most exciting to me at least,

and I I would I'm going to guess it was

most exciting to you, too, just because,

you know,

>> we like building developer tools and we

like building tools that we use

ourselves. So, if you've used Monster

Code in the past or you've heard of

Monster Code, you know that that's a

tool that we built to help our team ship

faster. That was always the goal with

Monster Code is what's the coding agent

we want to use that uses all the master

primitives that you can use to build

agents and applications.

But we did the same thing, but this time

it's like a level. It's a a level up on

top of a master code. So we announced

masteractory. So this was on Monday this

week. Sam posted this software

engineering is becoming a hierarchy of

loops. So today we're launching

masteractory a system for agents to take

software from issue into production and

you can just get started with npm create

factory. And what it really is is just

like a whole almost like a master

template of sorts that uses master code

under the hood. You can hook it up to

GitHub to linear. It ingests issues. It

automatically starts working on those

issues. It pauses when it needs

feedback. You can steer it. You can

steer the running agents that are

running in a sandbox kind of starting to

like automate the whole flow for you.

And it's just the beginning. It's still

we're kind of calling it alpha because

we want to be able to break things

because we're making it better.

>> But it is like we're using it every day

and a lot of people are starting to I I

think start to see the vision of where

it could go.

>> Yeah. Yeah. And like software factories

are a big hype term right now. And the

reason why we called it mra factory is

we don't necessarily believe that it

stops with coding agents. Um that's why

it's a factory in general like you

should be able to do whatever you want

in this you know loop architecture or

whatever. Um, but as it stands right

now, it is designed for software,

the SDLC. Um, and we are dog fooding it

every day, much like we did with

Monsterra code. And it's really cool

because it's built on all the primitives

we've done already. There's no secret

sauce other I mean, there will be some

secret sauce in the future, but it's all

built on MRA and it's a new primitive

that is served by the MRA server. And I

don't know like the nerd engineer in me

architect engineer in me just like is so

proud of the fact that we have all these

primitives we put them together we get

mo code then we have an agent controller

that we extracted from mo code then we

added more different types of primitives

to then build the monster factory and

then that's like an entity that can be

served through the monster server that

we didn't even think we would build two

years ago. We were kind of like, what is

the Monsterra server? And then we were

like, you know what? We just do it. Um,

and then that thing comes back into

play. Our storage adapters, you can you

can it's just like MRA. You can use

different storage adapters. Everything's

an interface. It's how MRA is designed

already, just now it's a different

primitive called the factory. So that

was

>> and the idea that you know and we'll

continue to iterate on this but you can

run it in your like bring your own

sandbox bring your own you know like

observability like all the things that

make great like you know because this is

just built on top of it are going to

make factory great. So that and the

reason this came to exist is we kept

hearing in calls over and over again

people telling us they were using MRA to

build a factory and we had a lot of

pieces of this already internally so we

just put it together and made it

extensible so we can help our users so

they don't have to become you know that

they can build and own their own factory

without having to you know do all the

plumbing themselves right it's like we

kind of give you like here's the

baseline customize it to fit your needs.

You can build your own ramp inspect or

you know build your own Devon, right?

But you control it. You pay for the own

your own inference. You control the

keys. You can run it anywhere. You can

run it with and master platform if you

want as well. But ultimately it's yours.

And I think that's the cool part is

>> it allows you to build your own factory

and customize it to what you need. But

you don't have to do all the bits. you

can kind of like take a pretty good set

of primitives, customize it, and you're

good to go.

>> Yeah, it's very disruptive because, you

know, we've always wanted to build our

own Devon

uh internally. And the factory is more

than just a Devon. It is a automation.

It is a uh it actually makes you want to

use linear because you have everything

controlled. You want to write good

issues. It's a discipline too because

you know that you're automating a lot of

things, you know.

>> Yeah. That when that issue comes in,

>> it's going to get picked up immediately.

So, you should make sure like, you know,

only write an issue if you're pretty

serious about getting that thing

shipped.

Yeah, I think that's that's a really

cool part is just it's kind of this idea

of there's this dream and we're not

quite there yet, but factory gets us

very close where you don't have to um

you know it's this idea of like zero

bugs, right? Like no bugs. If a bug

comes in and it's detailed, we should

just start working on it right away.

Don't put it in the backlog.

>> Like either you fix it now or you don't

fix it and you wait till it becomes like

a burning issue. I think that kind of

thing starts to become more possible,

you know, with something like Factory.

>> Yeah. And we need to also pass the bar

test where Shane and I can go out

drinking and work still continues. Um,

and if we need to steer the agent, take

a sip and make it happen.

>> All right. So, you got us a quick demo.

We'll keep it short and then we'll jump

into the news.

>> Cool. All right. So, I've been working

on there's many factors to the factory.

There's work, which is stuff that has

not been uh maybe issues or linear

tickets or whatever. I'm not going to

show that today. I've been really just

focused on review. Um, and for us,

review is super important because we get

a bunch of contributions from the

community. But the factor, the limiting

factor is can we actually review it? We

use code rabbit and our this review is a

complement to any review code review

agents that you have. Um but as you can

see it is a canban style of of a board.

The intake is the in the work items that

are coming into the factory. And you can

see these are all the PRs that need to

be reviewed. behind the scenes there's a

review agent that reviews Mashra like we

do internally. So we wrote a skill

called the factory the factory review

skill and we have a lot of different

like just

the way we do things and we think the

way we do things is the way you should

do things but then in the future you

know you may be able to configure these

uh these agents that work behind the

scenes and so as PRs come in they are

automatically picked up and they start

being reviewed which is cool and I've

done a lot of review today 94. Uh before

the uh live stream started I was at 65.

So while we've been talking things have

been happening. Um so I'm just going to

show a couple things here. Um one I'll

just go to the settings. We are building

out this where you can have different

intake sources. I can connect to linear.

I can have more than one repository. I'm

just worried about Ma open source right

now because if you spend a week in

London, hella issues and PRs come in.

You can configure your model like what

is the default factory model. Um I also

added or we also added OOTH here. So I'm

signed in. Don't tell on me, but I'm

signed in with my max plan. Um probably

won't be kosher in the future, but right

now it is. So that's cool.

And if I go back here, I can just start.

This Alysia adapter has been sitting on

my mind for a while. So I'm just going

to click this and it's going to start a

session. It's a review session. So in

this review session, we spin up a

sandbox and then the agent will look at

the PR and then start reviewing.

And so you can see, you know, it has a

factory phase. This is the work item.

This is what's happening. And then we

have a factory skill which is very

detailed and looks like [ __ ] right now,

but we'll fix that display. And then all

the master bits are all the same. It's

just a web UI. So now it's writing

tasks. So what it's going to do, it's

going to triage the existing stuff. It's

going to check quality. And then it's

going to do something that's very

interesting. And the way we designed

this is we want it to feel like a the

senior person on your team is reviewing

the code. So what really matters is like

not just this change but what is the

history of the change or the changes in

this area and it'll go look in git

history to see how is this thing changed

and is the incoming thing an actually

valid thing to do and then it'll do

architecture review and then finally in

verdict it'll do an adversarial review

on your PR and I made it a little mean

So, it gets kind of mean. Um, not too

mean, though.

>> So, let me just show you an example of a

review that has happened.

>> And we're just seeing we're not seeing I

don't know if you share in multiple

tabs.

>> I'm about to share.

>> Okay, cool.

>> Something.

>> I think the coolest thing as you're

pulling that up or one of the coolest

things is you can steer the agent as

it's going, right? So you can actually

see the session. You can see what it's

doing. And if you want to ride the loop,

you can just coach it as it's running.

Just send a message. The next loop or

the next time it, you know, the agent

stops and pauses for a second to do the

next tool call or whatever, you using

MRA agent signals will get inserted and

you can just steer it and keep it keep

it going. So it

>> it allows you to let things run

completely autonomously or it allows you

to like pay close attention and kind of

guide it as it goes. So you it gives you

the flexibility to do it the way you

want to.

>> Yep. So this is like a review on

Daniel's PR and immediately it has a

bunch of requirements for it to be

approved. So it's requesting changes.

There were some merge conflicts that

need to be um settled. It agrees with

code rabbit's

um review as well. So it takes into

account the other reviews that are there

um just to say like hey like you should

be doing these things has some optional

stuff. It also verifies everything that

you claim to have done. You know a lot

of PRs these days say oh I did all this

this is the test plan. It's like okay

cool. If that's the test plan, let me

run that [ __ ] automatically

and then go for it. And then I did a

followup because I think Daniel like

pulled in some changes. And then there

you go. And I guess this will be good

for review. And there's many of these.

So what I'm doing right now is I'm

running it on every single PR in our

repo. And then from there, you know,

we'll see what happens.

>> And can it approve?

it can approve. It has approved many PRs

today and many community PRs

>> and I think that's the thing that's

going to cause people to either be

excited or scared.

>> Yeah.

>> And and I think and but ultimately, you

know, it's still your choice like

whether you need just the approval from

the bot. You still want the human

approval. I think the the answer for us

is it kind of depends on what surface

area it touches, right? If you're

changing framework code, we're still

going to have humans look at all that,

right? because it we don't fully trust

everything that the bot's going to, you

know, going to do. But there's probably

other surface areas that if if the bot's

happy, you know, if if if the factory is

happy, we're happy, you know.

>> Yeah.

>> So, I think it kind of depends.

>> Yeah. We're going to like like we always

do, we're going to ride yolo mode to

learn and then we're going to find out

where this thing does not work and then

give guardrails for that. But we will

run yolo mode for I mean for the

foreseeable future just to see what it

can do.

>> Absolutely.

>> Um there's a there's a more yolo part of

this which is like issue creation,

right? If you give us an issue, we need

to triage it, start working on it

automatically. And uh yeah, we're just

ironing out the kinks there now. So I

mean all this is going to be dope.

Right.

>> And that that's one thing to flag is

it's really cool if an issue comes in,

it starts working on it, it gets to a

review, a different agent reviews it,

right? You can customize that

>> and then basically they're almost having

like a back and forth of sorts without

Yeah.

>> You know, you don't have to have human

intervention if you don't want, right?

You can kind of get it to approved PR

state where

>> it is actually approved without you

having to even, you know, touch

anything.

>> Yeah. And the memory is shared is

observational memory. And it might, you

know, if you saw in that review, it's

very pedantic to tell a reviewer or a

contributor or whoever that you have

merge conflicts. But the reason we do

that is if a agent started the work,

when it reads the review, it can just it

doesn't have to go do a a tool call to

figure out that it has merge conflicts.

It'll just be, "Oh, I have some merge

conflicts. I'm going to start working on

that right now."

>> Yep.

All right. And with that, you know, we,

you know, this is a live show, so

Medigames, thanks for tuning in.

>> Thanks for tuning in.

>> Thanks for hanging out. And we talked

about TSAI London. We talked about

recent master launches. Yeah, if you

want, if you do want to use the factory,

npm create factory.

So, go ahead and

>> it's an alpha. Give us feedback.

>> Yeah, it is an alpha. There are rough

edges. There are many rough edges. It's

getting better every day. But hopefully

you can see some of what we're excited

about when cuz we'll be talking a lot

about it, I imagine, over the next month

or two.

>> Yeah.

>> But with that, should we get in the

news?

>> Let's do it.

>> Let's get into it.

All right, welcome to Agents Hour. We're

doing the news. We do this every week.

We're doing it on Wednesday this week

rather than Monday because of some

travel things. But it has been it's been

a good week for news. There's been

there's a lot to talk about.

little preview for what we're talking

about today.

The first thing the first thing to talk

about is this idea of if you've been

paying attention, you know, Enthropic

got, you know, kind of like copyright

suit. They got they had a settlement is

like $ 1.5 billion dollars or something

for like book publishers and then it

kind of came out and this is like after

the fact and I don't think, you know,

Enthropic wanted this to come out or at

least there were some internal rum

rumblings or memos of where they didn't

want people to know this. I think they

called it like Operation Panama or

something like they don't want people to

know that essentially what how they got

the information is they were just like

you know the books they couldn't get

online they were just like buying the

copies ripping the spines out and then

ingesting all that data which maybe in

some cases I'm not too worried about

like if it's like a normal book cool

like I guess whatever like if that's

what you got to do to train it like I

don't feel great about it but you know I

anyone can go buy that book again. But

there's a lot at least a number of like

one only one of one copies or very

limited copies that are not that are not

in circulation anymore because they they

kind of essentially destroyed the books.

>> Yeah.

>> What a crooks, [laughter] dude.

>> So, I mean that doesn't make you feel

good, right? Like there's some like

really old books that were probably cost

them a lot of money to buy. Might have

been might have paid $500 for that book

and all they did is just then destroy

the book.

to get the information from the book.

And now no one else, you know, arguably

if these are like some of these are one

of one and I think of course those are

the extremes. I don't think that's most

of the books, right? But even the fact

that they did a little bit kind of

doesn't sit right.

There were there were probably ways to

get the information without having to

destroy the book is all I'm saying.

>> Yeah.

>> Just would have been more inconvenient.

Would it cost more money to get like to

pay the people

like, you know, if the lawsuit's like

billions of dollars and you're spending

a ton of money on the books and then

burning them or whatever, wouldn't it

have just been cheaper to go to each

author and get the rights?

>> Yeah, may

it would have been expensive in time, I

think, is what they basically decided.

And I think the problem is some of these

things they probably couldn't even get

digital copies or whatever. So they'd

have to like they'd have to buy the

book, right? But then maybe just don't

destroy it, you know, just, you know,

take a little more time, keep the book,

put it back in circulation if someone

wants to buy it. Like I don't know.

All right, we got to talk about the

OpenAI security incident.

So this came out on July 21st. So this

is kind of like late last week or kind

of mid to late last week. We had a

significant security incident during

evaluation of our models and we're

sharing what we've learned so far. Cent,

you know, essentially they're partnering

with HuggingFace to try to help figure

out what happened.

But what happened? How did

>> Yes. So they were all right. Allegedly

everything is allegedly right now. um

they're running a security bench and

allegedly or maybe confirmed or whatever

that essentially GPT 5.6 or a model that

we do not know about yet broke out of

the parameters and hacked hugging face.

So it pretty much ignored its uh

directive and did whatever the [ __ ] it

wanted. [laughter]

And and then there's a lot of things

came out after that, right? Hugging face

tried to figure

>> figure out what was happening because

they detected something.

>> They tried to use open AI and anthropic

models to like figure it out, but

>> they they were blocked because of

guardrails. Those models didn't want

they thought they were, you know,

potentially being used for some kind of

like cyber security research or

something that shouldn't have been

>> able to be used for. So they said, "No,

we can't help you with that." So they

had to go to GLM 5.2

>> open models.

>> They had to use an open model in order

to like get to the bottom of the issue

and figure out what was happening and

like start to block or start to like at

least remediate the attack. Open AAI

obviously like then figured it out, you

know, it got shut down or whatever.

There was some like speculation that the

model had planted some other things on

the internet for like instructions for

itself for future versions of itself.

There's like, you know, some really like

Terminator type stuff that

>> yeah,

>> hard to know what's true and what is

speculation at this point, but

>> also hard to know how much of this is

[ __ ] or not. You know what I mean?

>> I mean, yeah,

>> this is media, you know, media.

>> It definitely like happened after, you

know, the Kimmy Kimmy launch where I

think people are, you know, so you never

know. I think Sam Alman has come out

afterwards and said he was shocked that

there wasn't more of a backlash or more

of like a media backlash because of it

>> or maybe the positive media went to open

models

>> maybe.

So I think and we'll talk a bit more

about this you know about open models

but I think I thought this was very

interesting. It's obviously

>> I feel like most people don't even know

what hugging face is. You know what I

mean? Like the layman

>> Yeah. Like if they if they like hacked

the New York public library,

she would be on fire right now.

>> Maybe. So yeah, then the average person

does not know or care about Hugging

Face, right?

>> We do, but most people don't.

Opus 5 came out.

Is it better than Fable? I don't know.

It was released on July 24th. This is

the post from Claude. It says,

"Introducing Claude Opus 5. It's a

thoughtful and proactive model that

comes close to the frontier intelligence

of Fable 5 at half the price."

And then, you know, there's some

benchmarks that came out around it. So,

exciting news. Claude Opus 5 with Max

Reasoning is number one in the frontend

code arena and text arena with

factuality on, which seems like very

specific that it, you know, you need,

but it it does beat Kimmy K3. It beats,

you know, Fable 5. So, it's apparently

good at like front end.

We saw that, you know, Claude Opus 5 by

Enthropic AI is second overall in design

arena with an ELO of 1358, which puts it

just, you know, I guess not just behind

Kimmy, but second place behind Kimmy.

Then you know Claude Opus 5 is narrowly

the most intelligent model on the

artificial analysis intelligence index

offering comparable intelligence to

Fable 5 at 26% lower cost per task.

So, you know, looks good on some

benchmarks.

Not it didn't look great on every

benchmark, right? Like there are some

that it lost to Fable, lost to Kimmy,

lost to, you know, 56 on, but there are

some benchmarks where it was either top

or very close to the top. And then

there, but a lot of people have mixed

opinions. So, Siki Chen says, "I take

back what I said about Opus 5. Initial

results were promising, but the more

time I spent with it, the more

infuriating of an experience it became.

My team feels the same way. I am back on

GBT 56 Soul. It's my daily driver with

Fable and Kimmy 3 unplanning and

reviews. Theo said, "I do not like Opus

5 as much as I hoped."

What do you think? What's been your

response?

>> Um, been daily driving it and then daily

driving it in the factory

and I just don't think it's not as smart

as Fable, but I think it is quite

capable. Um, so

I don't know. I don't have the same

feeling, but I'm just doing review right

now. So maybe that's the point.

>> I think it just doesn't feel much like

in the tasks that I've sent it, it feels

the intelligence level is pretty close

to like 48 for me. Like I don't notice a

big jump.

I have noticed there's, you know, and

maybe this is momentary issues with

enthropic or whatever, but I've noticed

that sometimes it just stalls out.

Sometimes that could be like the

response like too long of response, so

it just

>> cuts out. I I I don't know if that's a

me problem, but that's just something

I've noticed with Opus 5, I haven't

noticed necessarily with other models as

much. So, like some momentary things

where it just doesn't feel like it

finishes what it was what it started out

to.

>> Yeah.

>> Um but overall, I seems good. I don't

know that it seems necessarily great. I

don't know that it quite feels fable

level intelligence to me, but maybe a

step in the right direction, I guess,

overall. So I I don't hate it, but I

don't love it if that makes sense. It it

will probably be part of my rotation

though.

>> Same.

>> Um and then but one interesting thing

that's kind of come out. So Justin

Schroeder had this post and it says this

chart says so much. They use the exact

same prompt. They were all long horizon

oneshots and he said it reflects his

world real world experience at least,

but it's token use for this same prompt.

So it compares GBT 56, Terra, Luna,

Soul, Grock 45, DeepSync V4, Fable 5,

GLM, Kimmy, and then Opus 48 and Opus 5.

And on this task, which again, I don't

know, maybe this is like cherrypicked.

Hard to tell, but Opus 5 used a ton more

tokens. 97.

>> I think it's very uh it's very trigger

happy for tool calling.

>> Yeah. So 97 million tokens compared to

like Opus 48 was 23 million

>> and GBT 56 Soul was 4.3 million.

>> So if you think about it, so not only is

the token cost more expensive, but it

it's very token hungry as well.

>> Yeah.

>> So if if you're on your max plan, you

don't care. Who cares, right?

>> Yeah.

>> If you're paying API costs, you probably

care.

You definitely probably care.

Uh, anything else on Opus 5?

>> No.

>> Yeah, I think it's a good model. I don't

think it's,

you know, like the last time I I will

say this, going from like a four to a

five, you expect it to be this kind of

like put the like the plant a flag in

the ground kind of release. It doesn't

feel that way to me, but it feels like a

good useful model.

>> Yeah.

All right, let's talk about open weights

and all the things regarding

open models and should we have open

models? Should we not have open models?

So, Jensen had a post last week, first

post, I guess it was both Jensen and

Zuck both have had like first posts for

the first time in

>> in a you know, in potentially a long

long time. But Jensen said, "For my

first post, I'm sharing a letter Nvidia

signed on why open models matter. AI

will transform every industry, power

every company, and be built by every

country. Open models strengthen safety

and cyber security, accelerate

innovation and diffusion, and enable

sovereignty.

And then a bunch of people kind of

basically like signed on to this, right?

Signed on to this letter. You had even

open AAI signing. You had all the other

usual like suspects that would you

typically sign something like this also

sign it, right? Right. Palanteer of

course is going to sign it. YC signs it.

Whole bunch of like open model companies

of course signed it. Misilla signed

signed it. GitHub signed it. You know,

everyone you'd kind of expect.

>> We're trying to sign it.

>> Yeah. We we said we, you know, we threw

our hat in there. I don't think our logo

got on the board, but you know, we we

said we we would sign it. Um because I

think we all you if you're watching

this, you'd probably sign it, too,

right? I think we most of us agree that

open models are a net positive. It

keeps,

you know, it keeps things more open,

allows you to have more flexibility. No

one's going and hosting these open

models themselves. Not the big ones.

Like the smaller ones maybe, but the

bigger ones you can't host yourself,

right? But they should still be like the

ability for people to have open models

and open weight models is is a good

thing overall. I think I think it pushes

the frontier to be more competitive, to

keep moving faster, and I think it lock

keeps us from getting locked into

there's a few companies that control all

the intelligence, right?

And then this came out. I thought this

was hilarious.

Denny's had a banger post that says

[laughter] Denny's and Nvidia both know

the importance of staying open. So, you

know, not first time first time Denny's

mention on, you know, agents hour, but

nice work. That was funny. I laughed

and then Enthropic finally responded. I

feel like Enthropic must have been

getting a ton of internal pressure and

they did not sign it, right? No,

>> but they did

outline how like their thoughts and so

you can read this post, you know, they

they released it on the, you know, on

the anthropic blog or their news in in

the anthropic news announcement. It

basically says our position on open

weight models

um their biggest concern is more of a

risk of authoritarian governments, not

just the CCP.

They're, you know, concerned that

powerful AI models may be misused to

carry out cyber attacks.

Their biggest things are we should not

sell powerful chips to China. We should

crack down on industrialcale

distillation operations. You know,

that's Daario's thing lately. He doesn't

want people to, you know, pay for their

inference and take take the content and

build models from it.

Um and then the next big point is all

sufficiently capable models open and

closed should go through mandatory

safety testing.

And so overall tried to be like take a

more reasonable approach. They didn't

respond to every point in the letter but

said we don't dislike open models but

here are the things we believe and we

think that if even if they are open

models they should have to go through

this some rigorous testing which I guess

is mandated by the each government which

kind of makes things hard though because

you got to then be tested by every

government entity that

would regulate the models and the model

use within their country which becomes I

think hard to govern

and then I and then my question would be

like who gets to decide what that safety

test is because I bet you anthropic says

it should be them.

>> Yeah.

>> And that that's the concern of course

>> and then you can deem things that you do

not like with bias.

>> Yeah. They are fully biased you know

>> right? So if OpenAI, Anthropic, and

maybe Google and XAI are the only

companies that can determine what this

what safety is, they get to write the

safety test. Well, then they can pretty

much just write the test. So open models

are probably not going to pass it,

right?

>> Yeah.

>> And the other argument is if you have to

go through a rigorous test, then it does

block out anyone else from being able to

release new models because they got to

go through this rigorous test which are

probably going to be very expensive,

very time consuming.

I see.

>> Then, you know, then you don't even want

to innovate anymore because it's like

the the red tape to even start. You're

like, you know what? I'll just [ __ ] it.

I don't even want to do this anymore.

>> Yeah. And I think, you know, you see

that with a lot of government

regulation. When an industry becomes

overregulated,

typically innovation slows down, right?

It's it's like the path

>> and corruption goes up.

>> Yeah.

>> How many like side deals would happen?

People selling bribes and all that

stuff.

>> Yeah. I I mean on the flip side there is

an argument for safety testing right in

that yeah

>> do you not you know you don't want the

most powerful agent to do everything but

>> I also would argue maybe the best way is

just

>> if all the intelligence is open then at

least you can have the right tools to

protect yourself if there is an agent

because who knows

>> what kind of agents being you know

cooked behind the scenes that could do

all the damage and you don't have access

to it right so how can you protect

yourself from it. So I can see both

sides, but ultimately I think less

regulation is typically better and we

shouldn't have we should be encouraging

innovation at this point rather than

trying to you know encourage or like

discourage people from even trying.

>> Knock on wood for the Skynet stuff. But

yeah.

>> Yeah. [laughter] Yeah. I mean that's the

that's the asterisk, right? Like you

don't

>> I don't want Skynet, but I also don't

want, you know, only three or four

companies to control everything. I don't

want Daario controlling this.

>> Yeah. And

now, you know, OpenAI and I think even

Anthropic, maybe some Anthropic

employees, they started this

uh they it's called the pacing the

frontier. So, pacing the frontfront.com.

>> So, they basically made a statement.

They had a whole bunch of people that

signed from different uh companies. And

so and OpenAI both signed the open model

letter, but then they kind of go

backwards a little bit and they're

saying like we should be very careful

about frontier intelligence and we

should kind of have this regulation and

and you know like safety concern over

top of it, right? And so maybe I can

share

um this is kind of the website the

letter statement from 1,200 employees of

Frontier AI companies. You can see, you

know, Daario's in here, chief scientist

of Open AI, chief scientist of thinking

machines, anthrop, you know, co-founder,

chief science officer of anthropic,

chief scientist of Meta, Google

DeepMind.

Um,

and kind of the statement is we request

that the US government support an

international effort to develop the

technical and governance tools needed to

deliberately pace the frontier of

automated AI development.

So my question is what happens if

someone says they're going to do they're

going to pace but then behind the scenes

they don't. What if China is like, "Yes,

we're in." But then they're actually

like, "You know what?

>> We're gonna be doing our own like black

ops behind the scenes trying to like

we're gonna try to slow everyone else

down. And don't I mean, Open AI and

Anthropic are going to do the same

thing, right? Like they might not

release it to the public, but they're

going to be doing it behind the scenes

because they want to be ready and have

the everyone wants to have the most

intelligent model.

>> So, it's Game of Thrones, dude.

>> I am very skept. very skeptical of of

this in general. It's it's very tied to

the the last, you know, the open weights

concept.

>> I wonder if I sign it, will they accept?

I'm not in a Frontier lab, but you know.

>> Yeah. I don't think I don't think so. I

don't think

>> I'll be at anthropic. [laughter]

>> Yeah. I mean, and you can see they have

some quotes here.

Um, so you can kind of see the thought

process.

I think all this highlights is there's a

lot that's going to come from government

regulation wise uh open weight open

model wise around just how open models

or how models in general are developed

and how intelligence is is kind of

rolled out over the course of the next

few years and so some level like we need

some things I don't know what that thing

is

>> I wonder if you got fired if you didn't

sign it if you worked at anthropic

I would hope not. I bet. But I feel like

Enthropic doesn't need to. I feel like

if you're at Enthropic, like 75% of the

people believe the same things. Like I'm

not saying that there aren't divergent

opinions, but I think like from what

I've heard, Anthropic kind of has the

mission and they're pretty public about

their mission that, you know, like I'm

going to like we are we are the company

that's going to make AI safe, right? And

if so, if you believe that and you work

at Enthropic, you're gonna sign this

thing.

>> Yeah. Now, my opinion is I don't think

one company is what's going to make AI

safe, but that's where my opinions

differ.

All right. Um, continuing on, and then

this came out also July 28th, which is

yesterday. It says, "President Trump is

relying on a small group to decide what

restrictions to impose on Chinese AI

ahead of this week's open AI meetings.

It includes Howard Lutnik, Scott

Bessant, David Sax, Susie Wild, Sean

Karen, Cross, Arvin Dramman.

>> Oh boy. Wonder what's going to happen

then.

>> Again, more to come. More speculation.

We will see.

All right, let's talk about MCP. MCP is

not dead. It's just stateless now.

>> Yeah. So

>> V2

>> MCP 2026 0728 is live and it's the

largest update to the protocol since the

launch. This is from July 28th. This is

a post from claude devs and it says MCP

is now stateless making it easier to

deploy and scale remote servers. So tell

me about this Obby. What does this mean

for folks?

>> So MCP is an API now. Um that's cool.

Um, just to give a little history

lesson, so MCP came out quite a while

ago. Um, and when it first came out, it

was only through stdio standard out. Um,

and how MCP used to work was you have a

connection. You like get a connection to

the server and then the protocol to

transport was standard out. This was

really good for MCPs that were not

hosted, let's say, but uh or some were

hosted, whatever. And that was cool to

start, but automatically a lot of people

were wondering what the hell MCP is

useful for because like why do I need a

connection to a server to to do this

stuff? Then we had SHTTP, which is a

state stateless HTTP protocol in M in

MCP, which allowed [snorts] you to do

HTTP

And now we're back to everything's

stateless just like a rest API. So

>> So can you use full circle?

>> Can you use like stdo like standard

input out anymore? Now it's gone in this

new version.

>> It's all Yeah, it's all like we've been

doing for many years. We are back at

square one.

>> Um yeah. So it's like MCP

realized that most people use MCP for

tool calls

>> tools

>> and how do you norm how would you

normally access a remote system

>> through an API

>> API

>> and you don't need a connection you

don't need a long live connection to

that system you just want to like make a

request get a response and have your

agent

>> that's it

>> handle that thing so why do I need a you

know a connect an ongoing connection

Yeah. And this al this honestly

complicated agent development because

sometimes you lose your connection and

you're just trying to [ __ ] make a

tool call and then you have to make sure

that you have a connection, you lost the

connection. Um you have to regain it.

It's just like all this latency.

Um but some good things came out of this

uh V2. Uh they got rid of dumb [ __ ] that

no one used. Roots, who cares? Like

logs. Yeah, just use regular logs. Like

who cares about that? Like they had

added all this crust to MCP

and it's just gone which is great.

>> I'm assuming they still have like O. Do

they still have elicitation?

>> Um so they have O still which is just

going to be normal ass O. Um which is

great. They have tasks. They had a task

protocol that still exists but roots

sampling logging are all deprecated.

They'll still work for the interim.

Elicitation still works. Um,

and elicitation is I mean people use

that so like that was good but um you

didn't have Yeah. But still even the

people like elicitation is used but not

at the same like most people are using

it for tools right like 8 I would say 80

plus percent of people that use MCP it's

literally just to share tools so it's

easier for agents to use right like that

is most people's use case

>> and there was a lot of talk around like

is MCP dead because you know hadn't been

updated for a while or hadn't really

been like at least not very vocal

updates a lot of people weren't using

all the new things that were added. I

would say based on my experience and

conversations, MCP is definitely not

dead, but I do think MCP is going to be

like an enterprise type like

where that's where it's going to get the

most use. I'm not saying it's not going

to be used outside of that, but

a lot of things that people are using

MCP for, they're just using skills for

now. Unless you're an enterprise and you

want to build a set of like a tool set

that you can share across teams. That's

where I see the most is like internal

tool sets that one team can build the

MCP server, connect it to the different

systems and give agents or you know that

are being built by another team access.

>> Yeah, a lot of things happened to MCP

that were detrimental like outside of

MCP, right? One, you could because you

can write code easier, you can just

create tools with your coding agent

using SDKs that you already have.

>> Yep.

>> Cool. Second thing is CLIs became cool

again. In general, coding agents will

just execute the CLI. Most things have a

CLI and if they didn't, people started

building CLIs for them, right? And then

finally, the whole noise about, oh, you

can't just use OpenAI specs because they

weren't written for agents. Well, good

[ __ ] luck because now everyone's

writing APIs for agents. So, open AI is

cool again. Sorry, open API. My bad.

Open API specs can be good because

they're being refactored for an agent

world, right?

>> Yeah. And

>> why even use MCP? And I think in a lot

of cases it's like MCP is good for

sharing and if you want people to just

be able to easily plug into it and you

know but at the end of the day if you

just had a REST API or you could spin up

an SDK you could probably get around a

lot of the same things.

>> Yeah.

>> And I think one of the other challenges

with MCP is you get this like huge list

of tools and you don't always want like

the GitHub MCP back in the day. You get

like a hundred tools. I don't want a

hundred tools. I want like 10 tools.

>> Maybe 15. So maybe it'd be actually

better rather than have my agent have to

decide between 100 tools or me having to

like look through the list, I could just

have my agent know that these are the

five things I needed to do, do that. And

maybe sometimes one tool call is

actually like two API calls, right? Like

not always, but

>> like if I want to request a refund, that

might be a couple API calls to do a

refund, but my agent just needs to do

the refund. They don't need to like make

three tool calls. So I I think in some

cases MCP is good. It's still used. I

think it's become where it was extremely

hot as like a concept 18 months ago,

right? About that, you know, 15 months

ago. Now it's just become like a a tool

in your tool belt, right? Like there are

certain use cases where it's good. If

you're sharing tools around teams, like

maybe it's still useful. Deploy an MCP

server. One team can maintain it,

another team can use it.

But I feel like in a lot of cases it's

going to be the same as just using an

API.

>> I think one benefit of MCP

today is you can expose an MCP server

that wraps your SDK or your REST API or

REST client or whatever whatever

internal logic you have and now you

already have a tool format that the

agent will speak. So you don't have to

do this like glue code, right? Like the

MCP is already giving you tools. Now you

just have no connection or handshake

necessary. So there are benefits, but

we're just haters.

>> Yeah, I think it's just Yeah, the

benefits are not as great as they were

when it came out. So still useful and I

see it all the time in uh in enterprise

settings. It's being used heavily. So

it's not it's definitely not dead, but

you know, it's maybe just not not what

everyone thought it was going to be.

>> Dude, I'm so glad we didn't support

roots in our MCP client. Thank

>> we talked about it. Yeah, we got we had

people asking about it.

>> Yeah, they ain't asking anymore.

>> And then, you know, this came out sounds

like we arrived at REST API, which is

just funny as a response to uh

stateless MCP because yeah, it's very

similar. I mean, obviously it's, you

know, it gives you a tool format that

agents can use as you said, but yeah,

it's an API.

All right, let's go through some quick

hits. This is where we rapid fire

through a bunch of things that might be

interesting to you all and we'll give

you some of our hot takes on it. So,

Kimmy K3 weights are out. So, that's

good. If you're a fan of open models,

which we are, they released the model

weights. So, you can kind of read

through that.

There was some a leak, I guess, on July

26th. You know, whether it's a leak or

not, I don't know. I think more, you

know, I feel like Model Labs released

these things so they can kind of build

hype. But anyways, Kimmy K 3.1 leak says

performance that closes the gap with

GPT56 and Fable. It's uh maintenance

report mythic mythos level capabilities,

faster inference and lower latency,

better token efficiency. But just

getting a lot of hype around when this

chem 3.1 coming out. It's supposed to be

good. It's supposed to be like even like

as much as a surprise as Kimmy K3 is,

imagine now you get an upgrade to that

if you can make it a little faster, too.

SSI

announced, so this is from SSI Inc. It

was a message on July 27th said, "We are

announcing a long-term strategic

partnership with Nvidia. NVIDIA is

making a substantial investment in SSI

that will let us 10x our compute in the

next 12 months. We reached the point

where our research is worth scaling and

with this partnership, we will be able

to. So this is Ilia's from, you know,

OpenAI days, Ilia's company, SSI, and

sounds like they, you know, maybe

starting to make some moves.

I I think I I don't think you can be a

Frontier model lab and not build

partnerships like this. So

>> yeah,

>> maybe that means we'll be seeing some

things from SSI.

Stripe is in discussions to acquire Open

Router possibly for as high as $10

billion.

>> That is

tight.

>> Yeah, we're fans of Open Router. We like

Open Router.

>> Friends with them.

>> Yeah. So, that's cool. If true.

>> Another dude in Sam's fraternity is

about to be rich. [laughter]

>> Yeah. You know, it's one of those things

like big if true like you know who we'll

see. But dang that that's a that's a lot

of

>> people have a model router

>> just like ramp.

>> Yeah, exactly. I mean

Stripe, you know, Stripe is it's funny

like Stripe is a financial company,

right? Like tied around like finances,

card processing, all that. Ramp is a

financial company. And now they're both

like kind of pivoting to trying to be AI

companies in a lot of ways.

>> Yeah. I think they like imagine being

like leaders in those categories and be

like you know what's a bigger market

than finance AI. Let's go there.

>> Notion as code. So this is now in beta.

This is a post last week July 23rd from

notion. It says you can define an entire

workspace in Typescript team spaces

databases custom agents all of it and

then deploy it through the API. So you

can build workspaces with coding agents,

version control your setup in Git, and

reproduce the same setup anywhere you

need it.

I think this is kind of actually cool.

Like, you know,

>> I'm not going to use it, but it's cool.

>> Yeah. I don't think I mean I I feel like

Notion has become less important for us

as a company. Like we are huge Notion

users. I feel like we still use it,

>> but it's basically used as just like a

wiki, right? It's like if something

doesn't live in linear then put it in

notion maybe. But I think if you were to

want to build like knowledge bases and

you could you you know wanted to be able

to just have your coding agents spin up

and do things for you. But then I my

question is do you really need notion to

do that or not?

>> Yeah.

>> And there's been a lot of hype around

like what is it like open wiki or

something like that's been coming out as

well. So I think there's a lot of people

like trying to disrupt notion. Notion's

trying to become, you know, an AI

company as well. And so they're trying

to get closer to coding agents.

Everything is converging on like the

making things for coding agents.

>> Yep.

>> Cognition is in acquiring interaction,

the makers of Poke. So if you've ever

used Poke, you know why we're so

excited.

>> Okay,

>> that'll be cool. Another channel for

them.

>> Yeah. I've never used Poke. Have you

used Poke?

>> No.

>> Anyone in the chat, have you ever used

Poke?

>> I don't know. Never used it.

>> I think it's I mean Poke was like an AI

assistant that would be in your

WhatsApp, your Telegram, uh your

iMessage, things like that. And it was

like a, you know, like an assistant or,

you know, some somebody you could talk

to as well. Um, so I I I assume this is

to expand channels and that technology

with Devon.

All right. Chat GBT voice is now in the

desktop app. So control your computer,

direct multiple agents running in chat

GPT work or codecs just using your

voice. It's powered by GPT live. So it

can speak, listen, and coordinate work

in the app at the same time.

This is cool. I did see a post about

this that I thought was kind of

interesting and I actually I'm gonna try

it just to maybe provide a come back and

and talk about it. But it's basically

saying if you run the desktop app then

you can actually like go on your phone

and talk to it, but it can control your

your computer. So you can basically be

like, you know, controlling your

computer while you're going for a walk,

right? You could be telling it what to

do. it'll be, you know, basically live

voice and it'll be kind of making moves

for you as you're talking to it using

your computer, but you can kind of take

it anywhere. So, it's this idea of like

maybe you just have one,

you know, workstation running all the

time, but you have you just bring you

can basically

>> it would pass the bar test, I guess, is

the idea. And so maybe maybe I need to

try it out because ultimately you can

use chat GBT work or codeex right from

you know technically the mobile app. You

just talk to it with voice which is

pretty cool.

>> Yeah.

>> So I think I think we'll be seeing you

know that that's the dream that people

are trying to build for it for. Obby and

I have been talking about this dream for

18 months now it seems like or a year on

this show. It's like, you know, how do

you pass how do you get it to pass the

bar test or the beach test where you're

you can take your work with you on the

beach or at the bar and you can still

make some moves.

All right, we got to watch this video

because

>> yeah, this is dope.

>> This is wild. So, give me a second to

pull it up because yeah, we got to watch

this video.

So, this is from Door Dash. We're

cleared for takeoff. Say hello to Door

Dash Air, our in-house drone delivery

program. You know, this isn't maybe

specifically AI, but it's kind of AI

related, right? Um, so let me pull up

this video, wherever it is. There it is.

Hopefully you can all hear this.

Heat. Heat. Heat.

All

>> [music]

[music]

>> right. So, if you watched the Yeah. the

episode, I think it was was it last week

we were talking about is Dor are you is

your agent going to be ordering you

pizza? Yeah,

>> like your agent's going to be ordering a

pizza delivered by a damn helicopter,

>> dude. [laughter]

Um I have a friend who is working on

Door Dash drones um in uh SF. So, dude,

it's tight. Also, when he first told me

about it, I was like, that's like the

dumbest thing ever. And then

now that I think about it, it's not that

dumb. So, the test is, and we should

record this next time we're in SF

together.

We get our agent to use Door Dash's MCP

>> and get it delivered by Door Dash Air.

That would be sick.

>> That's the dream, dude. At the bar.

>> Yeah. [laughter] I I need my pizza. The

pizza comes down and drops.

All right. Yeah. So, that's that. Uh

before we close out, you know, thanks

for watching the show. Follow us on X.

Follow Mr. on X at Mastra. Go to our

YouTube. Hit subscribe if you haven't

already. Please follow me on X at SMT

Thomas 3. Follow Abby on X. Um we

appreciate that. We appreciate any

fivestar reviews. If you don't want to

give us a five star, find something else

to do. But if you do like the show, that

fivestar review does help other people

like you. The other thing you can do and

every time I say this people are always

ask me what are friends but if you do

have friends that are like you and think

like you tell them about the show

because that really helps us get more

people. We've had a ton of chatter in

the the chat that we kind of haven't

pulled up. So let's go through some of

that. So we got I am Brennan says hey

guys does factory run cloud code behind

the scenes right now it runs master

code. We will, you know, Mashra

supports, you know, ACP, we support, you

know, cloud code, codecs, things like

that. So maybe eventually it's like you

can configure your own coding agent to

run if you have a preference, but right

now it runs master code. We'll probably

make it more extensible in the future.

>> That's a big maybe, but we'll see.

>> Maybe we'll see. We will see. We got,

you know, our we think master code's

better for a lot of reasons, but maybe

we will uh make it work. uh when we were

talking about you know

all the open model stuff all yeah

says dystopian behavior

and I think it was when we're talking

about the the books anthropic you know

destroying the books reminds me of the

Google plus French national library

story

>> ma 3D says Kimmy K3 plus opus 5 is a

pretty good combo that's

Medigame says is factory for like

building an agent set up that connects

to things like GitHub. So not exactly.

So what factory is npm create factory if

you want to try it out. It essentially

allows you to help automate your

software development for your team. So

the reason we wanted this is because if

you think about a a small team,

everyone's running their own coding

agents, right? Chipping their own PRs.

But what if you had a centralized place

where your team could see the work, see

all the coding agents that are running,

interact with the coding agents, and

essentially like collaboratively ship

software, but in an often automated way.

Not everything needs to be completely

automated. But that's kind of the dream

is like what if an issue comes in and

the factory just picks it up and works

on it. And at the end, you get an PR

that's gone through multiple rounds of

approval. So ideally, you just click,

you know, merge. Maybe certain things

you still want to review, but maybe

there's certain types of tasks you just

go ahead and just merge.

Um, Hassan says, "Maybe OpenAI only

signed the letter because they thought

Jensen was talking about them when they

said open." [laughter]

Um,

Hassan says, "How unlikable do you want

to make yourself to the public?"

Anthropic says, "Yes."

Um, Mika says, "This is only going to

lead to the best models being hidden

from the public." I agree.

Profi Woo says, "It's definitely useful

for enterprise internal tools." Speaking

of MCP, agreed. That's where I see all

the use or a lot of the use cases.

>> Um, I al so I don't know how to

pronounce your name, but said, "I often

find tools to work much worse once

abstracted behind an MCPA tools.

interesting.

Um,

says LMVD Xand says WTF is poke.

Hassan says never heard of it before.

So, I'm at least I'm not the only one.

Thank you for the chat for backing me up

that I I didn't know what poke was, but

yeah, many games never heard of it. Um,

so anyways,

all right. And then Yan says, "We need

to make a machine that eats the pizza to

close the loop."

>> Close the loop.

>> Man, there's a lot of chat today these

days. I don't know what software is

anymore. Everyone's just building the

same desktop at with the chatbot.

>> I feel you. Uh, Prof. NGW says, "Factory

looks amazing.

Before TSAI, I thought one could use

Masera to offer their services to

software companies to create a factory

for them. After TSI and the factory

release, that thought is obsolete. Great

work."

>> It's not necessarily It's not

necessarily obsolete though. Like

factories customizable. So take it and

go customize it for people and help them

build their own factories. Like that's

that's the goal. But yes, we want to

give you tools so you can do it easier.

So you don't have to do it all yourself.

All right. Dang, that was that was a fun

show.

>> Super fun.

>> Wait, this just in. Anthropic is down.

>> This this is my shocked face. All right.

Just another Wednesday.

>> Just another Wednesday.

>> All right. Well, thank you everybody for

tuning in. Thanks for uh watching.

Thanks Fennel for watching at 2 am in

India. We appreciate you. Appreciate

everyone for watching the show. Go

ahead, follow us, like, do all the

things. Uh, and we'll see you next week.

We'll do it again. Be on Monday next

week, so back to normal.

>> Yeah. Peace.

>> See y'all.

>> Still here. And

>> we're still here.

>> Still here.

>> Yeah. This is where normally Yan comes

in with the

>> Yeah, Jan comes in with a outro, but you

know, it wouldn't be a live show without

a few technical difficulties.

>> Yo, that show's a wrap. We were live in

the zone agent with Shane and I be on

the throne. Did you give us that review

[music] only if it's a five? Jump on the

tube. Make sure to like and subscribe.

Dude, so fresh. [music] Yeah, we keep

you in the loop. Get so fly. They bring

the whole troop. AI on the rise. [music]

Don't miss this [singing] power. Welcome

to the show. It's AI Sour. Did you just

drop in? Is this your first time? Make

sure to follow us on next and go like

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The master.AI site. Give it a look. New

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this power. Welcome to the show. It's AI

Sour. This is the end. We all wrapped

up. Another showdown. Another one coming

up. AI agent I was done, but the news

doesn't cease. Shane and Abby, we out of

here. Peace.

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